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Thread: cruelty towards animals

  1. #21
    Beloved Woman paradise-on-earth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by plingplong View Post
    If anyone meets something they don't find enjoyable, it means their alignment is 'off' and they now have the choice to live that way or to realign with enjoying everything, (which is what source does and Abraham suggest aligning with source)
    In the basis, you are right
    but letīs finetune that...


    Thing is, we did not come here to "enjoy everything". We came to find OUR PERSONAL PREFERENCES- and to line up with them as good as we can, without a lot of pushing against the things that we donīt prefer.

    Even source does NOT enjoy everything.
    Source does not enjoy cruelty and absence of love.

    Instead, source deliberately looks at the wanted side of every stick, that is present in every particle of the Universe- and not at the unwanted side, that is present in every particle of this Universe as well.

    When we do that- as source does, we feel wonderful. But it is about loving- and focusing on the wanted sides of everything,
    not about "loving everything".

    A very small but crucial finetuning.

  2. #22
    Beloved Woman paradise-on-earth's Avatar
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    Does source see the "Unwanted"?


    Esther will say from time to time,
    “Oh come on, Abraham. You gotta give me this one.
    (audience laughs) You cannot not be noticing THAT. It’s so big, and it’s so bad and it’s so WR-ONNG.” (audience laughs)

    And we say, we notice it.
    We just don’t see it as wrong.
    We just don’t condemn it.

    We see it, and immediately take from it what we prefer, and immediately turn our undivided attention to what we prefer.
    And if you will do that, you will feel as good as we do!

    “But what about righting the wrongs of the world?”, we hear you say; and we say, you will never make the world a better place by beating the drum with what’s wrong with it. However; you came forth as leading edge creators to explore the contrast because you cannot ask for improvement until you stand in a place that CAUSES the improvement to occur to you.

    So, it’s a wonderful thing that you have been willing to come forth to be an exaggerated version of step one of the process. You ask; step one. We stand, as Source Energy, as an exaggerated version of step two. Because when you ask, Source gives undivided attention to what you are asking for, looks right at your vibrational escrow, and holds the thought of that which you have become, because we are Non-Physical Energy.

    We are Non-Physical Energy; we can have the wholeness of the improvement before you can because you’re waiting for physical manifestation in most cases before you allow yourself the improvement. Did you hear that?

    Do you know that you could claim the improvement of your desire as quickly as we do, if you would be willing to look toward the solution and feel the pure positive energy of the solution?

    If you didn’t need the stuff to manifest before you feel better, you’d feel better all the time AND your stuff would manifest more quickly.

    -Abe (Autistic Revolution DVD




    from the collection
    What Source Sees

  3. #23
    Thank you Marc for the thorough reply.
    The way I see it, in the analogy of Jerry, I am not the observer like he was, but the "apparent" perpetrator who, while beating down the "apparent" victim, stops a second and realizes: wait a minute, there's actually a person in front of me, I'll stop taking it out on him. While it is true that in the big picture no-one is doing anything to anyone, there's a level where the aggressor can have a step 1, realize what he's doing is aggressive and stop. This was a step that Jerry didn't have to take, as an observer.
    Now, the former aggressor will also have to align and see through the evental Guilt, and understand that the apparent victim was a match to the experience and that the experience was valuable for both parties. And I am totally cool with that view. But it would still be natural to the process that he stopped aggressing the other and dealt with whatever is going emotionally without playing it out.
    The question here for me now has become: is there actual aggression* or is this just really natural, given that it is all One so it is bound to eat of itself one way or another? I have taken a step towards acknowledging that this may not be really the aggression I perceived it to be at the beginning of the thread, so thank you for the help in getting me to open up to more understanding. It took me a while, but I am getting better what you meant.
    I am really happy for this thread because I think this is a subject I have kind of evaded for decades, not taking the time to take a good look so as to resolve some split I felt.

    * what I mean by aggression is not really that there may be aggressive feelings, but rather that there is no acknowledgment that on the other side of our actions there are sentient beings like us.
    Last edited by rose essence; 1 Week Ago at 12:39 PM.

  4. #24
    Super Kitty Marc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rose essence View Post
    The way I see it, in the analogy of Jerry, I am not the observer like he was,
    Well, personally I disagree with where you've put yourself in that scenario, but ultimately, vibrationally speaking it doesn't really matter. Everyone involved is participating in equal measure.
    Quote Originally Posted by rose essence View Post
    but the "apparent" perpetrator who, while beating down the "apparent" victim, stops a second and realizes: wait a minute, there's actually a person in front of me, I'll stop taking it out on him. While it is true that in the big picture no-one is doing anything to anyone, there's a level where the aggressor can have a step 1, realize what he's doing is aggressive and stop. This was a step that Jerry didn't have to take, as an observer.
    That's untrue on multiple levels. On an action level, if Jerry decides to intervene on the behalf of the "victim" and tussle with the "aggressor," now he's an "aggressor" that's "taking it out" on someone else. He's just "aggressing" for a different reason than the other. Or if Jerry loses that fight, now he's the "victim."

    If he doesn't intervene and allows the apparent victim to get beaten, his position is essentially equal to yours now, as you're clearly not working on a factory farm. In your view, apparently that's equivalent to being an aggressor. That's the vibrationaly quandary. Someone is getting beaten up regardless of what action Jerry took, and the fact that it kept happening was LOA's very clear way of letting him know that he was participating in all this.

    On another level, Jerry DID need to have the experience where he realized that he needed to change himself in order for his experience to change. The point is that he was involved just as much as the people he rendezvoused with, because even when he removed himself from particular individuals, LOA would line him up with new people playing the same parts.
    Quote Originally Posted by rose essence View Post
    Now, the former aggressor will also have to align and see through the evental Guilt, and understand that the apparent victim was a match to the experience and that the experience was valuable for both parties. And I am totally cool with that view. But it would still be natural to the process that he stopped aggressing the other and dealt with whatever is going emotionally without playing it out.
    My point is the same -- the action and where you place yourself in the scenario are irrelevant. The vibration is what matters.
    Quote Originally Posted by rose essence View Post
    The question here for me now has become: is there actual aggression or is this just really natural, given that it is all One so it is bound to eat of itself one way or another?
    Exactly what else is there to eat? For one thing to eat, something else has to croak. That's true if you're talking about one amoeba eating another, or your beloved cow feeding on grass, or that grass feeding on the byproducts of other plants and animals that have croaked. Or bacteria feeding on the remains of those dead plants and animals. Things eat each other, that's Circle of Life 101.

  5. #25
    Beloved Woman paradise-on-earth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Things eat each other, that's Circle of Life 101.
    This reminds of this lines:


    HS is asking about our past, Abe have said there have been much higher amounts of population on this earth before; -was it HUMAN population?

    Abe:
    Yes, yes! Youīr pumping each other into your gas-tanks, even as you speak.
    (audience wonīt stop laughing)

    HS:
    Itīs tough being on stage with a comedian!

    Abe:
    Every good one needs a straight man, however.
    (more hilarious laughing)

    HS:
    Iīm always available.
    And you also have said, there have been more technologically advanced societies. Is there any evidence - or have they just been swallowed up into the oil?


    Abe:
    (mumbling, then: )
    Very good statement. WE will do the funny ones. (laughter)

    from the clip
    Abraham Hicks. Abraham about past advanced civilizations

  6. #26
    Yeah it makes sense. Thank you Marc, you were exactly the right person to cut through the story of victimization I was telling.

  7. #27
    Super Kitty Marc's Avatar
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    Believe me, even though I know how things work, there are still issues where things feel as black and white to me as what you're talking about. At least knowing that there's a larger truth helps.

  8. #28
    Beloved Woman paradise-on-earth's Avatar
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    Yes, isnīt it relief that even the most brilliant minds have their stumble-stones, once in a while. Much love to both of you.

  9. #29
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    Hi rose essence:

    Great discussion.

    For me it comes down to respecting and honoring the animals for their sacrifice. I am mostly vegetarian myself...I do still eat eggs (cage free) and dairy, though, and very occasionally, some fish. I would happily eat venison that someone hunted. I would never eat veal or fatty goose liver, since I know too much about how those things are produced and I wouldn't be able to enjoy it. If I could raise my own animals for food and did the butchering personally, that would be ok (although I might have a problem after raising them with killing them to eat, lol). Anyway, I just muddle on and do what feels right to me, trying to honor my own feelings and appreciate the animals as much as I can.

  10. #30
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    I always look for the "cruelty free" icon on the back of grooming and cleaning products - and take great delight in how many there are now to choose from in the mainstream big box stores. So my way of dealing with this is not to avoid certain items, but to seek out and enjoy certain items, appreciating how much more available they are in recent years. Many large companies have gone completely "cruelty free" and I thank them with my wallet.

    I realize that "cruelty free" is not really an Abraham concept, but that's the term in the manufacturing industry.

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